Last Guys Don't Finish Nice...
I am a Robert Greene fan. If you have no idea who that is, look him up here: https://www.theguardian.com/books/2012/dec/03/robert-greene-48-laws-of-power
That book he talks about? I have that one. And 4 of his others. People's opinions of him vary--some think he is a psychopath, some credit him as being the most brilliant strategists since Sun Tsu. Both are extreme impressions and I dislike eveything about extremism, so it is unlikely any of these reviews sway my opinion of the man. But, he's a smart guy and he gets people. So, he makes my list of influential authors. In many ways, we are very like-minded, Greene and I. We share many of the same opinions on people, on relationships, on power and the power of power.
I guess his outlook could best be described as pessimistically real. So, I suppose that makes him a pessimistic realist.
The following quote may be a tangible example of that theory:
"Niceness is a decision. It is a strategy of social interaction; it is not a character trait." --Robert Greene
So, dive right in. Forget about what anyone will think or say. Be as honest as you can when you consider and answer the question: Is Robert Greene correct about his assertion regarding niceness?
Include explanations, examples, proof etc.
That book he talks about? I have that one. And 4 of his others. People's opinions of him vary--some think he is a psychopath, some credit him as being the most brilliant strategists since Sun Tsu. Both are extreme impressions and I dislike eveything about extremism, so it is unlikely any of these reviews sway my opinion of the man. But, he's a smart guy and he gets people. So, he makes my list of influential authors. In many ways, we are very like-minded, Greene and I. We share many of the same opinions on people, on relationships, on power and the power of power.
I guess his outlook could best be described as pessimistically real. So, I suppose that makes him a pessimistic realist.
The following quote may be a tangible example of that theory:
"Niceness is a decision. It is a strategy of social interaction; it is not a character trait." --Robert Greene
So, dive right in. Forget about what anyone will think or say. Be as honest as you can when you consider and answer the question: Is Robert Greene correct about his assertion regarding niceness?
Include explanations, examples, proof etc.
I never heard of this man before besides the times Bunje talked about him and the books he wrote seem interesting. Reading more about him in the article made me realize how unusual he really is. I could never think they way he does, but I enjoy hearing his thoughts and not thinking they are psychotic, but more so amusing. When he says “Niceness is a decision. It is a strategy of social interaction; It is not a character trait.” I agree to his statement because not everyone on this earth has the same mindset and not everyone is nice. In order to have friends and people like you in this world you have to be nice which sometimes has a strategy to it, like when you want something from your parents, so you decide to throw them a few complements and help them with the groceries in order o get what you want. When green says he considers himself a realist in paragraph 3 I would agree with that. Not everyone can be classified as evil or nice there are so many other words to describe yourself.
ReplyDeleteI had no clue who Robert Greene was before we talked about him in class and before this blog. After reading the article I was still curious so I did what every curious person does when they want to know more about someone; I stalked his twitter. Based off of some of the things he tweeted about certain aspects of love, relationships, and even life in general were pretty eye opening. (I retweeted a couple things) I think the way he thinks is cool. It’s different and I respect it 100%. It really makes you think about things in a way you didn’t think you would... if that makes sense. I agree with you Bunj when you said you two are a like. The psychological things you say make my brain do backflips sometimes. But I really don’t find this guy to be psychotic or anything like that. I think he’s actually smarter than most people and that’s due to the way he views the things we brush off. For example, “Niceness is a decision. It is a strategy of social interaction; it is not a character trait.” This quote is right. Being nice isn’t a characteristic because in my opinion, no one is openly nice for the fun of it. I believe people are nice because of the benefits that come with it. When you’re nice, you can build bonds with people and even get what you want most of the time. It’s like when you open a pack of gum and everyone in the class starts being extra nice to you and stuff. This is where niceness becomes a strategy. People use it to get what they want and/or who they want. Not going to lie there are times when I’m only being nice for something I want. Like when I want to go somewhere so I do something nice for my mom so that my chances of her saying yes are better. I believe it’s better to be real rather than being nice. Overall, I’m interested in what other thoughts Robert Greene has about people, life, etc.
ReplyDeleteNiceness is a funny word, I'm just saying, I'm going to use it more. But I do believe niceness is a choice, really. I think some people believe that niceness is a trait because a person who decides to be nice a lot will probably just naturally begin to always be nice at the right times, so I think they see it as more of a characteristic rather than a habit. Although, some people are only nice to be liked by society or something like that, while others are nice because they know it's the right thing to do, or some do it because it makes them feel good, or some other type of reason for being nice. I, personally, am nice because of a lot of these reasons: because it makes me feel good, it's the right thing to do, and it's a natural habit of mine.
ReplyDeleteNiceness can be a bad thing sometimes, though. Some people fake being nice to get close to you just to hurt you, or just to appear as a good person to you or others. I think niceness itself has a good side and a bad side. But Greene is correct in my opinion, I think niceness is basically just a choice made from a person.
I personally have never heard of Robert Greene, aside from this blog and linked article I have not read any piece of his writing. After having read the article I can see where people may have conflicted views on Greene and his writing. Greene has very unique way of thinking that a lot of people may not understand but in a way I sometimes find myself thinking as oddly as Greene does in one way or another. When it comes to Robert Greene’s idea that “Niceness is a decision. It is a strategy of social interaction is not a character traits strategy of social interaction; it is not a character trait.” Robert in my opinion is correct about his assertion regarding niceness because not everyone is nice. You either choose to be nice or you choose not to be nice. some people think that not being nice is cool in a way and might get them more attention. As opposed to the other people who are nice and a lot of times get bashed for it. in today society more people who aren’t nice receive more attention or popularity in a sense. Being nice, to me feels good I feel like other people deserve to be treated nicely. I try to surround myself by most people because the energy give out is the energy you receive so if I’m nice I expect people to be nice back to me. Now that’s not always how it turns out because the world is a crock of shit but sometimes you’ll find people who are willing to match your so called “strategy of social interaction.” I know a lot of people don’t think about how they act they just act in a specific way which typically is there general personality but sometimes I’ll sit there and think what can I do for someone else to feel better. Being nice is not something people are it’s something people do and it’s a way to make people want to socialize with you and interact with you.
ReplyDeleteniceness• noun• the quality of being nice; pleasantness.
ReplyDeleteNow think of the quote by Charles Green, "Niceness is a decision. It is a strategy of social interaction; it is not a character trait." where in other words being “nice” is considered the social norm, a person can choose to be nice or a person can choose to be mean. Though you could define a person as, “nice” or “mean” but usually they’re not permanently defined that way. For instance, I’ll use our dear friend Hunter Boney, being the nice (trait) kid he is for Valentines Day he gave every girl in many classes a rose. It’s a simple act of kindness he does every year, but it's also a nice gesture. He does this because he chooses to or in his case it could be considered a trait, he’s genuinely nice.
In a way Robert Greene is right about his statement claiming that niceness is a choice not a character trait. And he also is right about the fact that it can used to be a strategy for social interaction. So yeah I would say I agree with Robert Greene because people do choose to be right and they do make the decision to be nice. And if your thinking over the top it can be used as a strategy especially when you want something from someone whether it’s a parent, (especially a parent back when we were younger) friend, or just in general. If a homeless person asking for change was mean or gave off a bad vibe they wouldn’t get any change just based on their attitude so basically niceness is being used as a strategy in that circumstance and it is used in many others that we may not realize or see.
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ReplyDeleteHonestly I’m not in a good mindset so this might be shit and I apologize in advance. Greene is right; mostly. Some people are genuine, but most are selfish. I try my very hardest not to believe that. It’s hard to believe that when my house is filled to the brim with people, who are supposed to be adults, need to be bribed to help me, feed me, etc. Tonight I’m with Greene and I think that people are usually nice when they have an ulterior motive. Whether it is to gain ground socially or receive a tangible thing I think people are assholes. I know not how I usually sound I try to think differently so I can act upon my beliefs and not succumb to the “oh everyone else sucks” mindset when I’m upset. Example: now. Yeah I think being nice is a “strategy of social interaction” so that we as humans don’t have to deal with people’s BS when they are butthurt about being hit with facts. We do it to receive awards and gain recognition among peers so others will gravitate towards us and give us respect. Social media enables this. So I deleted it. I want to do things because I genuinely want to do them not because I’m forced. People usually feel the same. But when faced with a large population that can quickly turn on you we’re forced to do more than we wish sometimes. Just to avoid being harassed everyday. This is highschool. I’m mad as fuck about that. I truly am and that’s why I try to be the exact opposite of that. Lay low, don’t make the connections to put me in those positions. ‘Cause people are really really selfish and shitty sometimes. I just want to avoid them so I don’t fit into Robert’s opinion. I want to be honest and real. I’m far too tired to do anything else.
ReplyDeleteRobert Greene is indeed correct about his assertion regarding niceness. It is each and every person’s decision to be “nice” each day. Presenting niceness consistently, on a daily basis, does very well help you out in life socially; you create strong bonds with others, you gain a good amount of trust from peers, and you become the person that everything knows they can count on. Although, being the “nice guy” doesn’t always get you far. For example, swallowing the harsh words thrown at you and not sticking up for yourself when need be, all because there is the SLIGHTEST chance you may come off as hostile, allows other people to view you as weak. Showing kindness sadly gets you walked all over and it’s fucked up.
ReplyDeleteI like exploring the mindsets of other people and I was curious to find out more about Greene’s thought process, so I went and researched more about him. After favoriting some tweets of his, I learned more about his way of thinking and that it’s very unique and, well, “thinky”. His words make you think, and I like reading stuff like that.
ReplyDeleteI thought it said John Green at first and I thought I knew who you were talking about. I then went back and realized it said Robert Greene and I have no clue who that is. But after reading the article I kinda got a grip of what he’s all about. As for the quote I agree with it. People are nice because they gain something from doing it whether it be reciprocated niceness, the person doing something for them, romance e.t.c. Being nice is not a trait because even the nicest people have people in their lives who they dislike and are not necessarily nice to them. They choose to be nice exclusively to their friends and to strangers in order to not come off as rude. For example, you will be extra nice to your boss if you are looking for a raise.
Although I have yet to hear about Robert Greene, regarding his assertion about niceness, I feel as though people use niceness like a switch. They turn it on and turn it off as needed. When people want something from you they “suck up” and turn on the nice switch. But once they get what they want from you they turn that switch off and turn back to their normal self. A prime example of this is during an election year. Politicians are nice to all people they come in contact with. They smile, laugh, hug and kiss everyone, especially the babies. And within a few days or weeks of being on the political trail, we see a segment on the news of someone secretly taping that same politician talking about the same group of people they were just being nice to. In addition, some people may not be comfortable so they use niceness as a crutch to help them get through an uncomfortable situation. I agree with Greene that people use niceness as a strategy for social interaction and it does not describe a person’s personality.
ReplyDeleteI do think that kindness is something that is chosen and gained. People are not born kind, it is something that grows and is taught over time. We all know a person who is just incredibly nice and it seems to be just an attribute that they were born with but in reality they at some point in their life made the decision to be nice. I once read something about a guy who one day just randomly chose to be the nice guy just out of the blue and then all the sudden people viewed him as someone who had been nice their whole life. It really is something that people pick and chose. Most of the time people choose to be nice or choose to be funny to be liked and known.
ReplyDeleteIt is a personal choice on whether you are a kind person or not. However your environment could influence your decision. Depending on the type of friends you surround yourself with and how the people in your family are, could subconsciously shape you. If you’re around rude individuals, often times you won’t see a reason to be nice to others. On the other hand, people’s kindness could very well rub off on you.
ReplyDeleteGreene had a point when he said being nice was a social strategy. It’s not uncommon that people become nicer to you when they want something from you. If you needed $20 from your mom, you know the best way to get it is to get on her good side and be nice to her. That’s a social strategy.
If you need help from someone, you may give them a compliment then ask them in a polite cheery tone. Again, social strategies.
It also doesn’t have to be to get anything in return. If one of your friends is having a rough day or is in a bad mood, normally a good friend would be kind to them and we all want to be good friends.
So ultimately, I agree with Greene, niceness is not a trait, it’s a strategic decision.
Robert Greene is right about niceness, it really is a strategy of social interaction. I’ve always wondered how some people are always nice or can change their mood in an instant and be nice to someone after just yelling at someone else. I never stopped to think that maybe they’re just acting, that’s basically what Greene is saying. They’re acting nice to others for their own eventual benefit. Anyone can act nice and be perceived as a “nice” person but also be thinking something horrible about the person they were just being nice to. That person would then be looked at as a nice person and that being one of their traits when in fact they’re nowhere near a nice person. We all know by now that people are fake which means no one really knows anyone’s true character traits unless you’ve known them for a substantial amount of time and even then you’re most likely wrong about their true person. For example, my grammy yelled at me once then someone called her and as soon as she answered the phone she was chipper and nice as ever. What I’ve realized is that being nice isn’t one of her character traits, it’s how she interacts with people in order to benefit herself in some way.
ReplyDeleteNiceness is a choice. For some it comes easy, others not so much. I chose to be nice because I don’t want to be just as shitty as some of the people I am surrounded by.
ReplyDeleteJust like being nice is a choice, it is also a choice not to be nice. But it’s not exactly that simple, like switching on and off switch. I’ve been nice my whole life, I smile at strangers, I hold the door, I remind other girls that they’re beautiful, I always try to ask people how their day is going, but because I’ve chosen to be nice for so long, I don’t know how not to be. And sometimes I get taken advantage of.
A lot of you probably know that I used to host parties at my house. Some of them got a bit out of control; these parties began as “get togethers” of 20 or so people and grew to become a bewilderment of unfamiliar faces in my backyard. Because I’m nice I didn’t know how to tell these people to leave. I just let people continue to show up until eventually the cops showed up too. If I had known how to not be nice maybe I wouldn’t have let people walk all over me in the first place, maybe things never would’ve gotten out of control. Because I’ve chosen to be nice for so long I don’t know how to say no to people.
In conclusion I would say that niceness is a choice but it is also a habit. I have a habit of letting people walk all over me because I don’t like confrontation. My “habit” has put me in some pretty awful situations. Yet I still choose to be nice because I think the world needs more nice people.
As a pessimist myself I believe that Robert Greene is correct on that niceness is a strategy opposed to an actual character trait. It’s not that people aren’t nice it's the simple fact that people turn it on and off like its a light switch. Personally I do it we all do for instance if I was going to ask my mom to go somewhere or for some money I would consciously make sure that I asked in a nice respectful way more so then if I was just having an everyday conversation. I know that sounds bad but its the truth just think about when you are meeting a new person you want to make a good impression so you make sure you are nice, sweet and respectful oppose to having an everyday conversation with your best friend. I could keep going on and on with examples but I think you get the gist. Even Though I haven’t read one of Robert Greene’s books I don’t think he is crazy or and extremist I think he is very realistic in the fact the humans are human and arent perfect even if we try our best were always going to have flaws one being were not nice all of the time.
ReplyDeleteNiceness is, without a doubt, a choice. Some people will make the decision to be nice without thought or do it more often than the average person. Those are the people that seem to be characterized as “nice”. I've never really thought anymore into why people are nice until recently. We assume that those who make the choice to be nice very often are just built that way, like they don't have a mean bone in their body. I'm pretty sure all of us have at least one “mean bone”, it's whether or not we decide to exploit that mean bone.
ReplyDeleteWhy are people nice or mean? This is stumping me because there are several different reasons as to why this can be. The major one sticking out to me is something that hurt someone. One can react to a traumatic or painful event by letting it consume them and hardening themself, or they may become overly loving, nice or sweet to keep others from the pain they endured. They might not hold to it every second of every day, yet it’s the conscious decision and effort to follow one of these paths.
I believe he's right on that one. Maybe it's just from my experience but i believe its 99% right. I mean when somebody describes someone as nice it isn't a personality trait, niceness is a conscious decision that someone decides at the moment. For example, if you were randomly to see a homeless person on the street and they don't smell too good or look to good. I personally ( if I had the money) would help because I've been there and i could sympathize but what if I hadn't been there before would I still feel the same? I don't think I would , it's a cruel thing to say but it's the truth. so, basically what i'm trying to say is that i would make a choice to be helpful or not. so, right now i would choose to be helpful and nice but if something were different my answer would change. That's why his theory is correct to me because if it was a personality trait you would be that way all the time. But, I don't know anybody who has been nice 24/7.
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